***Comment taken from the ‘Evidence of God’
“Society. I may be wrong but I think he is saying he is afraid for your soul if you do not believe Jesus is God in the flesh” (Michelle)
Agreed…but that’s not what he said – he did say this ‘I sense that you are not serious about God or the eternal state of your own soul’. If I said that to you Michelle (or anyone in here) – what do you think I am implying with that sentence? One, you dont care about God and two, you don’t care about yourself (my soul was mentioned) – nice…two commandments in one sentence.
I do not believe Jesus is God/Deity in the flesh – that’s not to say I don’t ‘follow Jesus’ and believe he was ‘the son of God’ and ‘Messiah’. I can say like John ‘every spirit that confesses that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God’ (1 John 4:2). Jesus (last name not Christ) the Messiah has come in the flesh and gone.
“to believe Jesus is who He claimed to be — the great I AM.” (Michelle)
I am a believer (in God – the I AM) but I don’t believe that statement. Now there is some claims to Jesus being divine in the NT (not gonna argue that) – but there is no concensus from book to book to letter. John and one verse of Paul allow for divinity (and John can be read a few ways – not just literally all the time) – but there are 4 real problems here that orthodoxy (these councils) did not ‘Flesh’ out.
(1) God cannot die…that is a fact none of us would dare argue. Fact is – Jesus does die (for a period of 3 days). Are we going to admit God can die…what a sturdy foundation we have been given?
(2) God cannot be tempted…another idea from the Tanakh and even the NT “for God cannot be tempted by evil…” (james 1:13). – Yet we know full well Jesus was tempted by Satan in the wilderness – for what…40 days! Granted he did not give in – but if he was God then who cares – that’s not being tempted at all. Ants build nice houses – but they don’t tempt me to want to live in them.
(3) Jesus is proclaimed to have been human – yet the orthodox position is clearly Jesus was 100% God and 100% human…I got some bad news for everyone – there is nothing human about that statement. Jesus has a whole 100% more than any of us in these convo’s – his God side…making him not a human but someone in the appearance of humanity.
(4) Jesus says he follows the One – “”What commandment is the foremost of all?” Jesus answered, “The foremost is, ‘HEAR, O ISRAEL! THE LORD OUR GOD IS ONE LORD” (Mark 12:28-29). That is the Shema in Jewish circles – which all Jewish people have recited for decades (prior to Jesus even) – and was supposed to memorized as the greatest teaching. Jesus, oddly enough, calls it the foremost teaching – so he agrees. What he is also saying there is ‘God is One’ in agreement with the scribe…does he think he is the One? From context – it doesn’t seem that way.
I think I raise fairly valid questions on these issues – and give plenty of reasons (from scripture itself) why I do or don’t accept certain ‘beliefs’. Does that realy make me any different than anyone else here?
***Now I am kind of tired of the Jesus and God debate (for writing in blogs) – but I laid out 4 good reasons I dare anyone to challenge – my own Josh Mcdowell/CS Lewis theory if you will. I think this is the best trinity case I have put together.